Greek theatre in EU parlament

Geschreven door RaulPB, 15.03.2016 at 20:13

Geschreven door Evic, 15.03.2016 at 17:40

Same goes for arabs and all muslims pretty much

I think you shouldn't generelize too much about such big topic... muslims have brought some scientific knowledge to Europe as well, not only wars and rapes. Let's try to be fair at least

All of the inventions they brought were chinese or oriental, not theirs, they simply transfered it.

Geschreven door RaulPB, 15.03.2016 at 20:13

Geschreven door Evic, 15.03.2016 at 17:40

Same goes for arabs and all muslims pretty much

I think you shouldn't generelize too much about such big topic... muslims have brought some scientific knowledge to Europe as well, not only wars and rapes. Let's try to be fair at least

Trying to explain that to a guy such as cicenavi, its like inviting a blind man to watch a movie

Geschreven door Evic, 15.03.2016 at 20:20

All of the inventions they brought were chinese or oriental, not theirs, they simply transfered it.

At least they did so. We would have killed the chinese people instead of adopting their inventions....

Geschreven door AlBoZzZ, 15.03.2016 at 20:48

Trying to explain that to a guy such as cicenavi, its like inviting a blind man to watch a movie

But at least the blind man would be able to listen to the movie and therefor would have a chance of imagining the movie

Geschreven door RaulPB, 16.03.2016 at 11:43

At least they did so. We would have killed the chinese people instead of adopting their inventions....

Oh gtfo with your white guilt!

Geschreven door Evic, 16.03.2016 at 11:57

Oh gtfo with your white guilt!

just think about it... what did we do with our colonies (for instance, America and Africa)?? Absolute annhilation...
Do you think it would have been any different with Asia? No, cause they weren't christians... things that would have happened during the medieval ages aren't easy to perdict so let's just be grateful that they brought that knowledge to us.

Geschreven door RaulPB, 16.03.2016 at 12:19

just think about it... what did we do with our colonies (for instance, America and Africa)?? Absolute annhilation...
Do you think it would have been any different with Asia? No, cause they weren't christians... things that would have happened during the medieval ages aren't easy to perdict so let's just be grateful that they brought that knowledge to us.

Man you really have no idea what you're talking about. Europeans did not wipe out the Americas, disease did. As for European colonies generally, they were for the most part the most benign empires the world had ever seen.

Geschreven door Acquiesce, 16.03.2016 at 12:32

Man you really have no idea what you're talking about. Europeans did not wipe out the Americas, disease did.

Well, as for the spanish part of america, ofc they would die of diseases if you put them to work like slaves, more than 12 hours a day in a mine, with little food and scarce water, not to mention the little hygiene they could afford or the absence of a medical treatment for them. We simply treated them as working objects; once one died, he was simply replaced for another. If that's not our fault, then Idk what have you been told. Btw, those diseases you're talking about were brought by us and if disease didn't kill them, our weapons did. Or simply exhaustion killed them eventually.

As for the english part of america, a huge percentage of natives were killed in war.

Pls, do not accuse me of having no idea when you seem to have less idea than me...

Geschreven door Acquiesce, 16.03.2016 at 12:32

As for European colonies generally, they were for the most part the most benign empires the world had ever seen.

Erm... how many empires do you know of which weren't europeans, which of them are you refering to and how where they worse? Because I really doubt what you refer to with this sentence.

Geschreven door RaulPB, 18.03.2016 at 06:17

Well, as for the spanish part of america, ofc they would die of diseases if you put them to work like slaves, more than 12 hours a day in a mine, with little food and scarce water, not to mention the little hygiene they could afford or the absence of a medical treatment for them. We simply treated them as working objects; once one died, he was simply replaced for another. If that's not our fault, then Idk what have you been told. Btw, those diseases you're talking about were brought by us and if disease didn't kill them, our weapons did. Or simply exhaustion killed them eventually.

As for the english part of america, a huge percentage of natives were killed in war.

Pls, do not accuse me of having no idea when you seem to have less idea than me...

Erm... how many empires do you know of which weren't europeans, which of them are you refering to and how where they worse? Because I really doubt what you refer to with this sentence.

I may have been a bit rude, and I do not deny that there were overworked slaves. My point is that more than 90% of indigenous American people died not at the hands of Europeans but because of Old World diseases like measles, smallpox, and flu. This is what the research says. http://www.pbs.org/gunsgermssteel/variables/smallpox.html

As for Empires that aren't European, there are literally dozens: multiple Chinese, Ottoman, Persian, Umayyad, Egyptian, Mongolian, Mauryan etc... they were all just as bad if not worse than European empires in their exploitation of subjects. The British Empire exploited peoples but it also brought democracy, common law and courts, infrastructure, education, medicine, and religious toleration. The late british empire was also the FIRST in history to abolish slavery, something the non western world still has issues with to this day.

Geschreven door Acquiesce, 18.03.2016 at 12:52

I may have been a bit rude, and I do not deny that there were overworked slaves. My point is that more than 90% of indigenous American people died not at the hands of Europeans but because of Old World diseases like measles, smallpox, and flu. This is what the research says. http://www.pbs.org/gunsgermssteel/variables/smallpox.html

As for Empires that aren't European, there are literally dozens: multiple Chinese, Ottoman, Persian, Umayyad, Egyptian, Mongolian, Mauryan etc... they were all just as bad if not worse than European empires in their exploitation of subjects. The British Empire exploited peoples but it also brought democracy, common law and courts, infrastructure, education, medicine, and religious toleration. The late british empire was also the FIRST in history to abolish slavery, something the non western world still has issues with to this day.

But you need to consider not only the disease itself, but also the circunstances, these being the lack of medical attention they had from Europeans, since we didn't care if they died or not. I know not all of the deaths were due to war, but even these deaths were very much our responsability as well... at least from my point of view. Spanish colonies were simply exploited and never were considered as a stable land in which we could invest. Natives were considered mere objects... even if some poeple had already died before Spain conquered them, I consider most of them died afterwards.

The thing is that most of these empires didn't have colonies nor territories far away, overseas. So they can't be compared to european colonial empires in certain ways. As for the British empire, they brought Apartheid. This still has consecuences today. Nothing is as pretty as it seems. All empires have exercised their influence over their territories, same as Rome had brought certain culture to its conquered territories. But this doesn't mean that all influence they had was beneficial. As for each Empire you've named, each one of them had good and bad things, they weren't demons nor angels. Just a quick example, mongols were quite rough with enemies, but kind with allies and brought real religious tolerance and opened comercial routes to all their territories. There's always two sides of the coin.

Geschreven door RaulPB, 19.03.2016 at 06:37

There's always two sides of the coin.

Precisely my point. So instead of glorifying middle easterners (science!) and guilting europeans (genocide!) because you think it makes you sophisticated, be fair and recognize every people have dark histories to answer for.

Geschreven door Acquiesce, 19.03.2016 at 09:23

Precisely my point. So instead of glorifying middle easterners (science!) and guilting europeans (genocide!) because you think it makes you sophisticated, be fair and recognize every people have dark histories to answer for.

But.... but... acqui... did you read the first comment about it...? I think you got it all wrong...

Geschreven door RaulPB, 15.03.2016 at 20:13

Geschreven door Evic, 15.03.2016 at 17:40

Same goes for arabs and all muslims pretty much

I think you shouldn't generelize too much about such big topic... muslims have brought some scientific knowledge to Europe as well, not only wars and rapes. Let's try to be fair at least

I was precisely defending that there are two sides of the coin and not only the bad part about muslims... pls acqui.... try to read again the whole conversation and don't accuse me unfairly

Geschreven door Columna Durruti, 12.03.2016 at 07:26

Indeed, thanks for the reminder that Marxism is a trash philosophy and that Fascism is the true workers revolution. Hail Golden Dawn! They wont back down to the EU or privatize ports. airports and energy sectors like the spine 'socialists' of SYRIZA. We will overcome.